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Endlosschleife Part 2: Mazedonier vs. Griechen

Mikrowelle schrieb:
Ja das ist mir schon klar aber ich meinte damit dass er wieder (womit ich recht behalten sollte) eine Flut von Copy Paste Attacken startet, völlig kreuz und quer

:mongolol: Was für ein dummes Gespräch
Zum Vergrößern anklicken....
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    Sie haben keine Berechtigung Anhänge anzusehen. Anhänge sind ausgeblendet.
Die Greco Foristen haben heute wieder mal kassiert. Und sie werden auch weiter kassieren. Fakten und Wahrheiten können eben nicht auf Lügen aufgebaut werden. Das sie das immer noch nicht verstanden haben ist aber nicht unsere Probljem.
 
The Macedonians were not Greek, but simply Macedonians, and Macedonia was never a Greek land. Actually, the very first time that the modern Greeks have seen the Macedonian sun symbol (Vergina sun) was only in 1978. However, the modern Macedonians had known about this symbol ever since Alexander the Great and his father Philip II had used it. The Macedonian sun can be found engraved on the centuries-old Macedonian churches and monasteries, and it is also common in the hand made centuries-old folklore designs. Therefore, if anybody is steeling this Macedonian symbol today, that is the modern Greeks, since they knew nothing about it until 1978, while the Macedonians had cherished it ever since its existence. We should point out that the original name of Vergina where the discovery was made in 1978, was Kutlesh. This original Macedonian name was replaced by the Greek name Vergina, after Greece swallowed 51% of the territory of Macedonia, including Kutlesh, with the partition of 1913.
 
The Macedonians did not speak a “dialect of Greek” but they had their own language. The above quote by Herodotus is misleading since Herodotus himself did not consider the Macedonians to be Greek.

“We have already inferred from the incident at the Olympic Games c.500 that the Macedonians themselves, as opposed to their kings, were considered not to be Greeks. Herodotus said this clearly in four words, introducing Amyntas, who was king c.500, as ‘a Greek ruling over Macedonians’ (5.20. 4)…” N.G.L. Hammond The Macedonian State p.141. Herodotus (7.130) speaks of the Thessalians as the first Greeks to come under Persian submission (although the Persians entered Macedonia first), and here using his own words, he clearly excludes the Macedonians from the Greeks. “Both Herodotus and Thucydides describe the Macedonians as foreigners, a distinct people living outside of the frontiers of the Greek city-states” – Eugene Borza, In the Shadow of Olympus p. 96.

Titus Livius (Livy) also didn’t consider the Macedonians to be Greek and the quote above is again misleading. Livy even wrote in details on the hatred that the Greeks had for the Macedonians, their name and race:

“Such were the activities of the Romans and of Philip on land during that summer. At the beginning of the same summer, the fleet, commanded by the legate Lucius Apustius, left Corcyra, rounded Cape Malea, and joined King Attalus of Scyllaeum, in the region of Hermoine. Hitherto the resentment of the Athenian community against Philip had been kept in check by fear; but now, with the hope of assistance ready at hand, they gave free rein to their anger. There is never any lack at Athenian tongues ready and willing to stir up the passion of the common people; this kind of oratory is nurtured by the applause of the mob in all free communities; but this is especially true of Athens, where eloquence has the greatest influence. The popular assembly immediately carried a proposal that all statues of Philip and all portraits of him, with their inscriptions, and also those of his ancestors of either sex, should be removed and destroyed; that all feast-days, rites, andpriesthoods instituted in honour of Philip or his ancestors should be deprived of sanctity; that even the sites of any memorials or inscriptions in his honour should be held accursed, and that it should not be lawful thereafter to decide to set up or dedicate on those sites any of those things which might lawfully be set up or dedicated on an undefiled site; that whenever the priests of the people offered prayer on behalf of the Athenian people and their allies, their armies and navies, they should on every occasion HEAP CURSES and execrations on Philip, his family and his realm, his forces on land and sea, AND THE WHOLE RACE AND NAME OF THE MACEDONIANS. There was appended to this decree a provision that if anyone afterwards should bring forward a proposal tending to bring on Philip disgrace or dishonour then the Athenian people would pass it in its entirety; whereas if anyone should by word or deed seek to counter his disgrace, or to enhance his honour, the killing of such a person would be lawful homicide. A final clause provided that all the decrees formerly passed against the Pisistratidae should be observed in regard to Philip. This was the Athenians’ war against Philip, a war of words, written or spoken, for that is where their only strength lies.” [Livy’s book XXXI.44]

Now that we established that neither Herodotus nor Livy considered the Macedonians to be Greeks, we can reveal the facts that the Macedonians did not speak a “dialect of Greek”, but they had their own distinctive language:

Alexander the Great speaks in front of the Macedones of his army: “The Macedonians are going to judge your case,” he said. “Please state whether you will use your native language before them.”

Philotas: “Besides the Macedonians, there are many present [Greeks and Persians] who, I think, will find what I am going to say easier to understand if I use the [Greek] language you yourself have been using, your purpose, I believe, being only to enable more people to understand you.”

Then the king said: “Do you see how offensive Philotas find even his native language? He alone feels an aversion to learning it. But let him speak as he pleases – only remember he as contemptuous of our way of life as he is of our language“. Quintus Curtius Rufus “The History of Alexander” [p.138]

This is Alexander himself talking about “our way of life” and “our language” “Macedonians are going to judge your case”, not about some “dialect of Greek”.
 

Macedonians fought together with the rest of the Greeks​

GREEK CLAIM: “Macedonians fought together with the rest of the Greeks. Macedonians always fought along with the other Greek city-states against enemies from Asia”.

REPLY:

This is an extremely week try to portray the Macedonians as Greeks. Actually it would be correct to call Darius’ army – Greek army, since 50,000 Greeks were fighting on Darius’ side against Alexander and his Macedonians, while only 7,000 Greeks served as ‘hostages’ the ambitions of the Macedonian king From Quintus Rufus“The History of Alexander” Patron, the Greek commander, speaks with Darius:

“Your Majesty”, said Patron, “we few are all that remain of 50,000 Greeks. We were all with you in your more fortunate days, and in your present situation we remain as we were when you were prospering, ready to make for and to accept as our country and our home any lands you choose. We and you have been drawn together both by your prosperity and your adversity. By this inviolable loyalty of ours I beg and beseech you: pitch your tent in our area of the camp and let us be your bodyguards. We have left Greece behind; for us there is no Bactria; our hopes rest entirely in you – I wish that were true of the others also! Further talk serves no purpose. As a foreigner born of another race I should not be asking for the responsibility of guarding your person if I thought anyone else could do it.” [p.112-13]

50,000 Greeks serving with Darius’ army and fighting against Alexander’s Macedonians. A legitimate and a very obvious question: If Alexander’s army was in fact a ‘Greek army’, as the modern Greeks claim, then how is it possible for a ‘Greek king’- Alexander, to hire mercenaries – Greeks, from his ‘own’ country? 50,000 strong Greeks were with Darius fighting the Macedonians, while Alexander took only 7,000 Greeks next to his Macedonians which served him as “hostages” and “were potential trouble makers” (Green), which he got rid of only when he learned that the rebellion in Greece against the Macedonian occupation forces there was suppressed (Green, Badian, Borza). The fact that 50,000 Greeks were fighting Alexander’s Macedonians shows clearly that their loyalty and their numerical superiority lies with Darius and his Persians, not with Alexander and his Macedonians. As Peter Green puts it: “if this was a Greek conquest where were the Greek troops?” Alexander’s conquest can not therefore be at all a Greek conquest, but simply a Macedonian conquest.
 
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